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Discussion Starter #21
guides are the same.

yes mine has a greater inlet duration, less exhaust,

Robert Cox heads look alright as far as shiny ported heads go but because heads are so very different performance wise who knows what will be good, not all views are positive. There is a lot of opinion over hand ported vs CNC which affects many buying decisions, personally the best heads I've used have been hand ported and finished, but I haven't used loads of different heads so again it's another opinion. Slark cylinder head preparation or Bryan Slark Racing have done all my classic Mini heads, and Tritec heads I have are Lohen, Allstage, Cosworth, JCW, the current one being Allstage, otherwise known on here as Shed. As I've said before it isn't all in the head, and other people's views come into play making it a hornets nest overall with few sound solutions perhaps.

The current head with stock inlet size and bigger exhaust made 230whp @7.2k with my cam and 233whp @ 7.6k with the 1302469 Catcam, and 234whp @ 8.16k with the Newman PH3/4, when my cam was run up I didn't have this custom Maniflow manifold so the cam is back in waiting to be run up again, I'm expecting could be 235whp+ but overall the Allstage head works very well. On its own responsible for a 14whp gain with my cam. I'm only interested to see if it recovers the ~2hp loss to the 469 in the upper midrange which I suspect it had due to the manifold maybe but we'll see.

A thing with heads is also that you can have several from the same place and one stand out which fuels an argument for CNC, but the counter argument might be that castings differ, meaning CNC can have the same or similar variances in performance, additionally a taping service if offered for a CNC head is hand finishing anyway, so back to the hand ported head at least for me. Cosworth heads there is a fair amount of negative feedback for especially in the US as it was Cosworth USA that did them, and the view is they don't make that much, but a lot of this is about the combination I think, definitely I would say having experience of the affects this can produce, there is no rule to get this right especially with a head produced to a spec you have to find a cam for, really the cam and usage would be better given to the head prep company so they can tailor the head and valves or springs and valve geometry etc. Again, only my view fwiw.

the JCW head above will be added to 'fitted only' parts I occasionally sell, just like the Lohen BVH,

I did message mod a mini about providing some flow numbers for comparison against other heads but as yet no reply. Tbh I'd be more interested in the torque curves and when they started to drop than a +/- 2bhp, I'll have to have a re read of the cylinder head thread later today.
Not heard of the Slark name in years! Ex Downton man. (y)
I've seen that with some tuning companies, CNC heads blah, blah then you read a bit more and they're all hand finished anyways. ?
How come you went that way with your EW02 profile? With the campfire banter saying that the exhaust is the restrictive side surely the greater gain would be for more exhaust duration? Or would that have knock on effects with scavenge and exhaust gas drawback?
 

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Discussion Starter #22
What's an allstage 'shed' head? Never came across them before?

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A guy called Dave Crisell (Bing search ?) Big on the VW scene so it seems, lots of big name companies farm their head work out to him, TSR being one..... who I personally can't recommend enough! Tim at TSR and Jim at Awesome GTi, when they were still on the farm in Audley (only a couple of miles from home), helped me empty my bank account each week when I had my first MK2 Golf GTi ??
 

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maybe message JannerSy for flow data on RC heads, he's posted them on fb, I think he just went direct as most seem to?

yes ex Downton, long time since I've had to have anything done but will be the first stop whenever I need another,

Allstage yes, long time doing VW work it seems,

plot here for three cams run in the Shed head, EW02 (short dash), 469 (long dash), PH3/4 (solid),

99286
 

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Discussion Starter #24
You can see the Newman is too big a cam for that particular head. Have you run a PH2 with that head? Would be interesting as it has more of a street application.
 

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indeed, although Jan at RMW thinks my valve timing was out ;O)

PH2? No I chose not to, plenty of people ran it years back and later made significantly more when they went to the 469, in or out of ported heads it would appear from stuff written/claimed over recent years, with that in mind it was never in my sights. Each test costs ~£500-£600 all said and done, if I already know my cam is performing close to the 1302469 in my car at least, and has less of its warm up or idle and off idle slightly scruffy characteristics, also proving to be a slightly more efficient cam for me, and still with excellent road manners similar to the PH2 while making more than it, bar some rhythmic hunting at idle, I'd have to ask myself why it'd be worth it. The only downside mine has to the PH2 is that it needs 50-100rpm if running it with no map which like the PH2 it will do better than the 469 or some attention to the map to prevent stalling. A small trade off me thinks for a road cam that does what it does. Any Autologic kit with BMW/MINI licence can do raise the idle in minutes if running it without a map.
 
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Discussion Starter #26
Yeh, when I first found MT I picked up on a cam thread that you had a lot of input in, swapping and changing cams over then re running on a dyno. Do you just use a standard cam pulley or a GTT Vernier for the tests?
I take it by increasing the RPM your 'masking' the valve overlap with the centrifugal effort of the engine?
 

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Yeh, when I first found MT I picked up on a cam thread that you had a lot of input in, swapping and changing cams over then re running on a dyno. Do you just use a standard cam pulley or a GTT Vernier for the tests?
I take it by increasing the RPM your 'masking' the valve overlap with the centrifugal effort of the engine?
I have a GTT sprocket on the other car so could use it doing all this, although these cams are all supposed to be bolt on and go so I've stuck to that at the moment. I have an ATI damper on which is useful having a scale. I'm pretty sure there are cars losing something to timing here, having skimmed heads and stretched chains both retarding cams slightly potentially. On my classic I use a Vernier type duplex which is something I'd ideally like to have made for these. We may have roller tips but there is some fair strain turning the cam, especially once we have changed them for performance items, then there are stronger springs etc. I'm sure it'd sell.

I tend think of it as air speed, I don't like too high an idle though, mine is usually ok with ~900 even with its alloy flywheel, the others happier at ~1000, Newman smoother/constant strong idle in the 3/4 at least. I'm happy with some degree of hunting if it's rhythmic and stable, kind of nice in my little world.

The 469 doesn't have to hunt at idle
Possibly not, but it isn't me mapping it £££. If I ever revisit the EMU which is permanently in the glovebox just needing the ECU/PnP swapping back and LSU4.2 plug moving from the gauge when I do, then I'd mess with it no doubt as you have.

On that point .... I asked Tom if they'd altered any pins in the PnP harness and apparently not, it was run as is on Scott's car briefly for a couple of hours then on mine so I guess my lack of throttle is either a setting I've changed or most likely missed perhaps that was different on MadNick's PnP harness used with the turbo kit, or perhaps just down to the knackered sensor I recently changed which kept flicking the AFR gauge to 22.4 eventually sticking there. Unsure if that would cause a total lack of throttle, need to look I guess.

Would you have your sensor where the primaries meet, or in one primary as with stock, or in the post cat spot for a steadier reading? Currently mine is where the primaries meet but looking at the AFR bouncing around as it is a bit still with the new sensor, makes me wonder if there'd be a negative affect on the EMU. If ok where it is I'm tempted to switch off the post cat lambda in BT and use the spot for the AFR gauge. Even if I do fit the cat later it'd still give me a good gauge where it's important.
 
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I have a 4.2 about 8 inches away from the turbo and it's never missed a beat. You can actually filter the response of the sensor if the flickering gets on your tits
 

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What's an allstage 'shed' head? Never came across them before?

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Allstage heads are hand ported by Dave who has ported heads for years made infamous by Alski who made 240 whp with an Allstage head.
Reading between the lines there’s not much between all the BVH out there I have tried a few and I would go for a 1320 head if not cost restricted or allstage for a cheaper variant but he uses triple groove valves so will limit the Rev range to around 7400 but you would probably not need to go any higher on a road car .
 

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forgot your manifold is totally different. I'm unsure whether it's considered a great idea to run the sensor in just one branch of four for a standalone, I'm inclined to think it'd be better/safer taking a combined reading where it is.
 

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Allstage heads are hand ported by Dave who has ported heads for years made infamous by Alski who made 240 whp with an Allstage head.
Reading between the lines there’s not much between all the BVH out there I have tried a few and I would go for a 1320 head if not cost restricted or allstage for a cheaper variant but he uses triple groove valves so will limit the Rev range to around 7400 but you would probably not need to go any higher on a road car .
Thanks for that mate, I'll be looking for some head work within the next six months I hope so will definitely give that option some thought. I was planning on buying the valves, spring, retainer's etc..and taking them to a local engine machine shop to have them fitted/ported. But everyone here seems to stick to a few suppliers and rarely drift away from the proven product. Probably for good reason

1320 are obviously the go to for anything R53, but I get the impression there's a tax on that as their services seem a bit steep, and they pretty much have the R53 market wrapped up.
I keep toing and froing over the idea of turbocharging my car but most turbo owners seem to be having engine/head rebuilds quite regularly. If I do, my plan would be a nice safe 300bhp build if that's possible.

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Shed heads for a time were the 1320 head, they just supplied the valves they wanted him to use,

I think heads can be entirely different, I have one here that cost over 20hp compared to the Allstage/Shed, just looking at some like the Robert Cox ones no doubt might have a similar affect, or worse haha, who knows, certainly the variances from different cams used in them all can be startling.

Lee have you still got the guides we never got sorted?
 

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Thanks for that mate, I'll be looking for some head work within the next six months I hope so will definitely give that option some thought. I was planning on buying the valves, spring, retainer's etc..and taking them to a local engine machine shop to have them fitted/ported. But everyone here seems to stick to a few suppliers and rarely drift away from the proven product. Probably for good reason

1320 are obviously the go to for anything R53, but I get the impression there's a tax on that as their services seem a bit steep, and they pretty much have the R53 market wrapped up.
I keep toing and froing over the idea of turbocharging my car but most turbo owners seem to be having engine/head rebuilds quite regularly. If I do, my plan would be a nice safe 300bhp build if that's possible.

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Thanks for that mate, I'll be looking for some head work within the next six months I hope so will definitely give that option some thought. I was planning on buying the valves, spring, retainer's etc..and taking them to a local engine machine shop to have them fitted/ported. But everyone here seems to stick to a few suppliers and rarely drift away from the proven product. Probably for good reason

1320 are obviously the go to for anything R53, but I get the impression there's a tax on that as their services seem a bit steep, and they pretty much have the R53 market wrapped up.
I keep toing and froing over the idea of turbocharging my car but most turbo owners seem to be having engine/head rebuilds quite regularly. If I do, my plan would be a nice safe 300bhp build if that's possible.

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Not heard of many head rebuilds on turbo cars any more than you would on a supercharged car both reliable when done right but the mini heads do have inherent faults cracking across the valves and cracking towards the timing chain cover.
 

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Discussion Starter #36
forgot your manifold is totally different. I'm unsure whether it's considered a great idea to run the sensor in just one branch of four for a standalone, I'm inclined to think it'd be better/safer taking a combined reading where it is.
If you were after every ounce of power then 1 per cylinder + standalone would be your ideal, but a wideband, controller and boss x 4 ain't cheap, so I'd say best bet is stick with what manufacturers do and place it where it can take a mean reading from all 4 cylinders.
 

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Discussion Starter #37
Allstage heads are hand ported by Dave who has ported heads for years made infamous by Alski who made 240 whp with an Allstage head.
Reading between the lines there’s not much between all the BVH out there I have tried a few and I would go for a 1320 head if not cost restricted or allstage for a cheaper variant but he uses triple groove valves so will limit the Rev range to around 7400 but you would probably not need to go any higher on a road car .
Jungle drums say he doesn't do private any more....... just company work. How true this is I'm not sure. ????
 

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I have not spoken to dave for a while now but i would think he will do private stuff i know he has a few delivery mileage heads left to sell once upgraded.
 

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The drums might be right, He had a long waiting list in 2008, I had some local connections and lived a few miles away, I would be surprised if you will be able to get one done in the time frame you want. And that’s assuming he has the valves sat on the shelf, not sure how the supply chain looks at the moment...?
 

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The drums might be right, He had a long waiting list in 2008, I had some local connections and lived a few miles away, I would be surprised if you will be able to get one done in the time frame you want. And that’s assuming he has the valves sat on the shelf, not sure how the supply chain looks at the moment...?
He had valves and heads about 18-24 months ago but that is not to say he has any left but seeing he is difficult to get in touch with i would say you would have a good chance and bvh dont fly off the shelves normally
 
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